User talk:Peter Z./History Notes

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Peter Z's Notes

• Firstly it appears to me that the region (former Yugoslavia/West Balkans) has problems with interpreting multicultural and multiethnic history (& societies)!

If we put aside political correctness, concernig Korcula's history

If we put aside political correctness, one could ask the question what happened to the Latin families on the island of Korcula (Corcyra Nigra) in the 7th century when the Croatians (Slavs) invaded. The Croatians invaded the Eastern Roman Empire (Byzantine) province of Dalmatia.

Events could have unfolded (& most probably did) which led to them being attacked and killed. The survivors could have fled from Korcula to Ragusa (Dubrovnik), then a place of refuge. Maybe some survived and remained on the island.

Judging by what happened to the Roman cities of Dalmatia; Epidaurum, Narona and Salona (which were then part of the Byzantine Empire), these towns were destroyed. The Avari participated in these events too. This pattern of aggression of the Slavic tribes in conquering new territory must have continued during the following decades (& centuries) of the dark ages. In this historic period it is recorded that many of the churches on the island of Korcula were destroyed (then rebuilt at a later stage).

It is likely that the new population settled in the centre of the island (Cara). The centre of the island had its strategic qualities which allowed protection on all sides from attack by sea. It also had fertile land which allowed cultivation. After the invasion of Slavic Tribes the region stabilised to a certain extent. The Byzantine Empire and the Republic of Venice started to exert a political influence over the region and it’s new peoples. These events have been recorded historically by both Empires in chronicles of the time. The Latin population eventually started to return to the island in larger numbers thus creating a historic multicultural and multiethnic society.

Dalmatians of Latin ancestry brought Mediterranean cultural to the Slavs. Christianity was one aspect of this. In essence the Croatians on the island were Romanized.

In 889 AD it is documented that there was a clash between the local Croatians (from Cara) and the Venetian army. The story is part of the Island of Korcula's oral history.

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Below taken from Historical Compendium of the Island of Curzola by Nikola Ostoich:

• Subject to the Roman Emperors first from the west, then from the east, by Augustus at Heraclius until 642
• Defeated and confederated by the Neretljani from 642 to 999
• Conquered by the Veneti under the management of the doge Pietro Orscolo from 999 to 1100
• Held by the Genoese from 1100 to 1129
• Recaptured by Popone Zorzi, from the Veneto Region, and by the Republic of Venice subjected to this house from 1129 to 1180, from 1252 to 1254, and from 1258 until 1357
• Possessed on behalf of the king of Hungary from 1257 and with brief interruptions of the Genoese until 1418
• Devoting itself of its own accord to the Republic of Venice in 1420, and held by it with exemption from any tax until 1797
• Surrendered with the Veneto State to Napoleon I of France, and united with the Kingdom of Italy from 1806 to 1807, and later from 1808 to 1813 annexed with Dalmaatia to the Illyrian provinces
• Taken and held by the Russians in 1808
• Taken from the French by the English and guarded for themselves from 1813 to 1815
• Occupied by Austria, first by obligation from 1797 to 1806, later by Vienna Treaty from 1815 to the present 1858

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Below by Peter Z.

• Indigenous population of Korcula were Illyrians. It is believed that the Illyrians arrived in the Balkans approximately 1000 BC.
• Greek colony was founded on Korcula. Greek colonists from Corcyra (Corfu) formed a small colony on the island in the 6th century B.C. The Greeks named it "Black Corfu" after their homeland and the dense pine-woods on the island.

Lumbarda Psephisma is a stone inscription on the island of Korcula, in modern-day Croatia. It is believed that the psephism is from the 4th century B.C. The Greeks established a settlement on the basis of a prior agreement with the representatives of the local Illyrians who were Pil and his son Daz.

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Quote: Best of luck. During the time of hieromnamon Praxidam in the month of Machaneus a contract was made to establish a colony between the people of Issa and Pil and his son Daz. Colony founders agreed upon and the people decided: those who where the first to occupy the land and built a wall around the city would get a special land to build houses within the fortified city, especially with a part, and of the land which was outside the city, so that those first people separately obtain the first lot of three plethrons separated from the land, and from the other parts, to write down (what lot and what part) each of them obtained, and in permanent ownership they (and their descendants) get one and a half plethrons each; subsequent colonists are to get from undistributed land in the field four and a half plethrons; the authorities swear never to divide the city or land again; if someone of the authority proposes something or someone agrees against this (Psephism), let he or she be dishonoured, and his or her property should become public property; the person who kills him or her is not to be punished……… This land was obtained and the city walls built by: Dymanes, Hylleis & Pamphylois.

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• Roman province of Illyricum (indigenous population of Korcula were Illyrians)
• The island became part of the Roman province of Illyricum. After the Illyrian Wars. Roman migration followed and Roman citizens arrived on the island. In 10 AD Illyricum was split into two provinces, Pannonia and Dalmatia. Korcula became part of the ancient Roman province of Dalmatia.
• In the 6th century it came under Byzantine Empire rule.
• The Great Migrations of the 7th century, brought the Slavic peoples into the Dalmatia region.
• Second Slavic Migration in 17th & 18th century.

Additional:

• Venetian & Ragusan families (Jewish families from Spain).
• Korcula originally a Latin town. Latter became Latin/Venetian/Slavic (Croatian).
• Cara (or Čara) originally Slavic (Croatian) village.

Interesting: Cara used to be called Hara. The Austria-Hungary census registered Cara's name as Kcara. The Statute of Korcula was first drafted in 1214. It was probably written by Latin & Slavic (Croatian) Nobility.

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Historic quote: "In 1262 the Venetians praised the Slavs and Latins on the island of Korcula for submitting to the prince Venice"

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In 16 century Stone writings in Zavalatica are dedicated to events from 889 AD. It describes a clash between the Croatians and the Venetian army. Marinko Gjivoje wrote about the find in 1972. The stone writings states: Hrvat Dalmatinac in its writings.Hrvat means Croatian in Slavic.

Note: Croatian (Slavs) started to be referred too (& referred themselves) mainly as Dalmatians Slavs or Dalmatians, sometime post 11th Century.

Korcula's old name was Curzola. The Old-Slavic term was Krkar. (Korcula a historically a multicultural and multiethnic society)

Korcula was part of Dalmatia

In 1918 Korcula (then called Curzola) was part of Dalmatia. Dalmatia was a province in the Austro-Hungarian Empire and was already more than a century old (Dalmatia itself as a region, dates back to the Roman Empire). According to the Austrian censuses it was predominately made up of Croatians and Italians (and other minorities). With the disintegration of the Austro-Hungarian Empire in 1918, Serbia started occupying the region (Italy did the same). This was part of the Treaty of Rapallo. It was interpreted back then as the formation of the Kingdom of Serbia, Croatia & Slovenia.

The new kingdom had the support of Great Britain and France, who were the superpowers of the day. In retrospect this was a tragic move, one that the United States was against. The effects of this political stupidity are still felt today. It is interesting how this newly created state “Kingdom of Serbia, Croatia & Slovenia”, which later became better know as the ill fated Yugoslavia, was given a lot of support over the succeeding decades. This part of European history surely needs more academic attention.

Signor Arneri stated:

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These three pears you see on the wall," said he, "are the arms of my family. Perussich was the name, when, in the earlier part of the fifteenth century, my ancestors built this palace; so that, you see, I am Dalmatian. All the family, fathers, sons, and brothers, used to serve in the fleets of the Republic (Republic of Venice); but the hero of our race was Arneri Perussich, whose statue you see there, who fought, bled, and died at the Siege of Candia, whose memory was honoured by the Republic, and whose surviving family was liberally pensioned; so his name of our race. We became Arneri, and ceased to be Perussich

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According to Marinko Gjivoje, Perussich is Piruzović''.

Naši - The Us (ours) People

• Grammatica Della Lingua Illirica by Francesco Maria Appendini (Ragusan-Dubrovnik/Italian) A book on the Croatian language written in 1828. Section of the book here

• Below taken from Dalmatia and Montenegro: With a Journey to Mostar in Herzegovina by John Gardner Wilkinson. Published in 1848 (p33).

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Naski (ours) or Illirskee is a Slavonic Dialect.

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• Editors notes: Naski or in Croatian Naški. The š is pronounced sh. (Interesting: Blato was called Blatta)
• Korcula Dialect (or Korčulanski) is a Croatian dialect from the island of Korcula in Croatia. According to the Croatian Anthropological Society in their Collegium Antropologicum (Volumes 15-16) the language base of the Korcula dialect is Chakavian Croatian (it is also intermixed with Shokavian). The dialect has remnants of the extinct Romance language, Dalmatian. The Dalmatian remnants within the dialect have been referred to as Corzulot. Additionally it has influences of Venetian.
• Defora in old Venetian means "from the outside".

Local folk song: Zbogom, Moja Bobovišća Vala

Zbogom, Moja Bobovišća vala

kad san kanta, sva is odavala

Druga mladost kad bude kantati

valo moja, nemoj odavati"

Zbogom, moje sve od Blata divnje

s kojima san uźa pasat vrime

(traditional)

Translation:

Goodbye my Bobvisca bay

When I sang ...

Republic of Ragusa & Republic of Venice became a political football for the former Communist Yugoslavia

Latin/Illyrian/Slavic communities history of the historic Republic of Ragusa & Republic of Venice became a political football for the former Communist Yugoslavia.

• Republic of Ragusa was set up by Latin/Illyrian families.
• Republic of Venice was set up by Latin families.

(Venice acquired Slavic & other Latin populations through conquering)

Slavic communities later became part of these City States, which later became Republics.

Famous mixed marriages within these communities :

• Roger Joseph Boskovich (Republic of Ragusa)
• Fausto Veranzio (Republic of Venice)

Their family heritage were Croatian & Italian.

Austro-Hungarian census 1816 registered: 66 000 Italian speaking people among the 301 000 inhabitants of Dalmatia. (ref from: Montani, Carlo. Venezia Giulia, Dalmazia - Sommario Storico - An Historical Outline)

Republic of Ragusa

Republic of Ragusa was set up by Latin/Illyrian families. The Republic's city, Ragusa (today called Dubrovnik) was established in the 7th century, post Slavic and Avar invasions. The refugees from Epidaurum (a Roman city) built the settlement in Dalmatia, today in southernmost modern Croatia. Over the centuries the City State-Ragusa started to have relations with the Slavic hinterland, then called Red Croatia (this term for the region ceased to be used from the 11th century onwards). Ragusa itself became an independent state in 1358.

The Croatians (Slavs), some time in the middle ages started to be part of the Republic's population.The Croatians from the 11th century onwards were mainly called Dalmatians Slavs. The 1667 Dubrovnik earthquake, which destroyed the greater part of Dubrovnik has been cited as a turning point for the Republic's ethnic population make up. The Slavic population in the Republic would have been Romanised (adopted Latin culture).

In John Van Antwerp Fine's book "When Ethnicity did not Matter in the Balkans" the population of the Republic in the 15-century was describe as mainly Slavic. This is very plausible, (that by the 15 century) the surrounding area of the city of Dubrovnik, the Slavs would have been in the majority.

There is a theory that the actual Croatisation (Pan-Slavism) of the region started to happen in the 19-century, with the Republic becoming part of the Austro-Hungarian Empire (then called the Habsburg Monarchy). The second theory is that it was much earlier.

Sir John Gardner Wilkinson

Sir John Gardner Wilkinson (October 5, 1797 – October 29, 1875) was an English traveller, writer and pioneer Egyptologist of the 19th century. He is often referred to as "the Father of British Egyptology". He was in Dubrovnik in 1848, this is what he wrote in his "Dalmatia and Montenegro: With a Journey to Mostar in Herzegovina":

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Their language though gradually falling into Venetianisms of the other Dalmatians towns, still retains some of that pure Italian idiom, for which was always noted. (page 362)

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Italian is spoken in all the seaports of Dalmatia, but the language of the country is a dialect of the Slavonic, which alone is used by peasants in the interior.(page 4)

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Maude Holbach (a 1910 travel guide)

• Dalmatia-The Land Where East Meets West by Maude Holbach (a 1910 travel guide from COSIMO books and publications New York USA):

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Two hundred years later that, is, early in the tenth century you might have heard Slavish and Latin spoken had you walked in the streets of Ragusa, just as you hear Slavish and Italian today; for as times of peace followed times of war, the Greek and Roman inhabitants of Rausium intermarried with the surrounding Slavs, and so a mixed race sprang up, a people apart from the rest of Dalmatia. (p121)

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Editor's notes: It's quite possible that the Republic was for centuries a multicultural and multiethnic society! It's ruling class were of mostly of Latin decent, but not all! Peter Z. 06:13, 25 September 2010 (UTC)

When ethnicity did not matter in the Balkans: a study of identity in pre ... By John Van Antwerp Fine

• Neretljani here

• Contradict himself here

• Plus:spiritus-temporis.com here

Concerns over Dalmatian Articles (other Croatian articles too) and Wikipedia

Firstly it appears that Wikipedia has problems with interpreting the history of the Dalmatian region, with it's multicultural and multiethnic history (& societies). There is a editing bias that seems to pre-vale and in the end and the articles will then reflect points off view, rather being encyclopaedic. As events are unfolding the bias goes mainly towards the former Communist Yugoslavia (or other-depending on the situation).

Croatia DNA-Test

Taken from www.igenea.com

• Illyrian People 34%
• Slav 20%
• Celtic 18%
• Teuton 12%
• Phoenician 8%
• Hellenic People 8%

(Editors notes: Oh Dear!)